Are ALL Forum Members to be Trusted?

[KarshS]

Hhmmm...

 

[RAArmstrong]

Eagerly waiting to see what the fan club has to say on this matter. Eerily quiet for once. This is the one time we want to hear you @"bman"

 

[individj]

i dont care if this man is a car god...i dont want information or knowledge from him i can look elsewhere.
Something similar happened to my cousin and myself with a mechanic....i got my money....he had to pay people to not be killed....he had to disappear after that..he is no longer with us RIP but Gizmo got off very easily with this.
Even if he has changed i feel its still very light punishment for him to be banned for life.

 

[Rishie Rish]

So basically Gizmo was caught red handed being dishonest to the forum members and this community, but members on this forum want to defend him by saying he has "good posts" as if it counts for anything now, the very same members would want to shame if it was another person for the exact same reason if they were robbed.

All I see is, there was fraud, proof of the incident

And here we are still debating asking questions?

For what?

Awaiting that ban hammer

Sent from my SM-N960F using Tapatalk

 

[michael.joseph]

@bman nothing to say?

Sent from my SM-N975F using Tapatalk

Best comment in this thread

LoL
:roflol: :roflol: :roflol:

---

In all my time on this forum, this is by far the most disturbing thread that I've read.

Appalling and disappointing to say the least.

Bringing something like this to light isn't easy, I know... so kudos to Peter and Moose.

Ban or no ban, this thread will be here for all to cross reference and its gona take years for trust to be regained, if at all possible.

 

[TBP88]

I'm pretty disappointed myself. I had Gizmo do a *lot* of work on my car, which I do think was done to a good standard (indeed in the subsequent 3 yrs I've had 0 mechanical issues).

However this does leave a sour taste in my mouth. I am happy that I had Peter to also look over the car.

All in all this is a sordid affair and while Gizmo will take a hit to his business I do wish him well and that he can rebuild his reputation.

To the dudes who got scammed, all I can say is eish. As much as, yes, it was shit and you did want to move forward. I think a lot of the frustration here stems from the fact that you knew you got scammed by gizmo, and yet stood by while others sent him work.

He has been a recommended mechie on the forum for a while and if you had knowledge back them of him being a scamster you should have shared it, for the good of the whole (hell, isn't that the point of the forum?). Either way, you guys are in no way in the wrong, you seem to have been victims of theft, and I place no blame at your door. You're not *required* to report anything. But if you want to call the forum a family etc. etc. you also need to advise the rest of us as to where things go wrong.

In conclusion, nobody here wins. Gizmo comes out very poorly, customers have incorrect or used parts on their cars and Peter is having his own rep questioned. Probably the first time this forum has made me feel a bit naar.

 

[Arbee]

It's very much the same as a thief breaking into your house and stealing your belongings and when this usually happens, we call the cops and if the thief is caught charges are laid, arrested etc. Lets not get into the reality of how easy it is to get out of it but an apology doesn't work rite?

Gizmo stole from Moose and who knows how many other fanatics or customers.

Apart from airing it out here, which protects this community, is it not grounds for getting the law involved? Is it too late? Is the proof enough?

Banning Gizmo from here is acceptable to the community but it doesn't stop him from doing the same via any other medium, tomorrow he could very well open up a shop and continue to do the same to the person on the street.

My 3c on it...

Of all people it happened that Moose picked up on it, one of very few stand up members on this forum IMO. Although i feel that if this was out in the open 5 years ago, the community would be less threatened. In the same breath, i respect you for keeping it on the low to try and protect Gizmo and his bread and butter.

 

[WIDEOPN-X5]

So there is has been alot said in this thread.
What Gizmo did was, by his own admission, inexcusable.
But what I would like to know is:

1) What vested interest does Peter have in this whole matter?
2) Why was Peter the news reporter?
3) Why didn't Moose expose Gizmo when he found out about it?
4) When did the transgression of 5 years ago first come to light?
5) Why was Gizmo's services still used for couple of years by Moose and Peter free of charge? 
6) Is that not appalling also as it condoned Gizmo's actions and resulted in him being blackmailed?
7) Something is not adding up, Gizmo stood by Peter all the way through the famous M3 bearing debacle, where did things go South?
8) What is the main reason for Peter wanting to expose Gizmo after all this time t the extent of copying the link and adding it to a Gizmo thread?
9) Moose posted the screenshots where Gizmo admitted to him that he was wrong so how could he deny it after he put it writing? 

Those who live in glass houses should not throw stones.

I am not a Gizmo fan boy. I have used his services twice on my 320d and the work he did was excellent and well priced. 

I have to agree with what is written above. Why the need to raise this issue now some 5yrs down the line? What's the back story? Why is this NOW suddenly in the best interests of the Fanatics Forum... 

Moose, where's your additional input on this?

We've read "there's more information" so why the cloak and dagger.

Airing of dirty laundry has started this morning so why not get it all out there so people are able to make an informed conclusion instead of being fed part of the info / circumstances.

""@"WIDEOPN-X3"

I believe I’ve answered this already, thanks""


Moose I meant no offence in my question to you. I misinterpreted the thread in respect of you providing additional information and for that I apologise and yes I see your explanations. I'm afraid it doesn't look good for Warren and by his own admission his actions were inexcusable.

Some have raised the question of whether, in the absence of written proof, the admission would have been a blanket denial. Indeed, Warren did initially deny the incident again which is unfortunate.  That said, as a person with a very soft side I also believe in "rehabilitation" and recompense in certain circumstances. Simply banning Warren is not in my humble opinion the only option. The man made some poor decisions, tried to cover them up but now has acknowledged these things. I say it again, I'm hardly a "fanboy" and can only go on my dealings with Warren and say that the experience was great. 

I guess I'm just one for saying that people can change, can grow and can make amends for transgressions. If this were not true every jail sentence would be a life sentence, no? People who commit crimes are given a chance to change their ways and in most cases will do so. Granted, often times those mistakes will haunt the perpetrator for the rest of their lives but it is of itself a reminder to them not to do it again. If no lesson is learnt then the person has no conscience or moral fibre and I don't believe that is the case with Warren.

 

[TurboLlew]

It's very much the same as a thief breaking into your house and stealing your belongings and when this usually happens, we call the cops and if the thief is caught charges are laid, arrested etc. Lets not get into the reality of how easy it is to get out of it but an apology doesn't work rite?

Gizmo stole from Moose and who knows how many other fanatics or customers.

Apart from airing it out here, which protects this community,  is it not grounds for getting the law involved? Is it too late? Is the proof enough?

Banning Gizmo from here is acceptable to the community but it doesn't stop him from doing the same via any other medium, tomorrow he could very well open up a shop and continue to do the same to the person on the street.

My 3c on it...

Of all people it happened that Moose picked up on it, one of very few stand up members on this forum IMO. Although i feel that if this was out in the open 5 years ago, the community would be less threatened. In the same breath, i respect you for keeping it on the low to try and protect Gizmo and his bread and butter.

Not speaking for Moose here but from my own experience, you are already so mentally spent (and you feel like an idiot when you play back the timeline to yourself and see all those warning signs) that you just want to move on with life when presented with the prospect of getting even via the law and the cost and timelines involved. You also hope that Karma takes its course... the wheel turning and all that. 

These are very loose arrangements as well when you're 'dealing with family' and it ends up being he said/she said. It isn't like BMW where you sign your life away when you book it in. That is why this is so much worse than 'usual' bad suppliers IMHO

There is also stockholm syndrome to some degree where you feel bad/pity for the guy even despite what has happened.

 

[Cornel]

Why is this still going on?

Kick him and get him out of the fanatics group.

Don't entertain it!

He's rep is blown up big time so doubt that he will ever get anything from any fanatic.

Same goes from his fanboy's, if they sad about it, let them loose as well.

Magtig man, maak klaar

 

[Woodies]

I thief got caught. Like another post above, I also have a hard time trusting anyone, the world is a hard place full of lying, cheating, horrible people. I put thieves in that category. It is a pity because he looked like a good mechanic. Now he looks like a good conman/thief who happens to also be a mechanic. He took his own bread off his table when he became a thief.
As for rehab, once convicted, you always have criminal record that sticks with you. I will never look at thread from Gizmo again

 

[Pho3niX90]

All I can say is this.

Was always impartial to gizmo, he has always been nothing short of a douchbag, but his threads were interesting.

If he can steal from a 30yr old friend and his family, then he will most certainly steal from anyone.

This matter is simple. He is a criminal and to allow him to stay, just means BMWF (admins and mods) condones such behaviour. If he stays then I will most certainly not return, as I will always question everyone on here.

I have known Peter for a long time now, and he has even worked on my cars, Peter I take my hat off to you, by standing by your moral compass, to out the criminal activity that went on, it's without question that you have saved a lot of people a lot of money by outing him.

I miss the days where the members would pitch in to fix a fellow fanatics car (for those that can remember the witch), and now it has turned into this?

At this point, lock the thread again, and give gizz'mo 24hrs to say his final words.

 

[AshG108]

Catching up on some of the comments: Imagine stealing a diff off a very low mileage customer's car for whatever reason. The owner then finds out and doesn't break your knees or lay charges or hire hitmen or even want to take bread off your table... Surely you're thanking your lucky stars and turn over a new leaf immediately and do your best to keep this guy happy?

Fast forward to 5 YEARS LATER and you're getting hot under the collar on whatsapp of all things for whatever reason. This same guy that caught you stealing from him red handed is somehow coexisting with you in a group. You feel like it is unfair of him to remind you of your dodginess... the same guy who STILL doesn't want to out you. Over this one comment, you are so aggrieved that you then go and (effectively) incriminate and blackmail yourself (whilst accusing others of blackmailing and accusing you) because you have to have the last word and can't handle being wrong...

Is there any self-aware person who would do this? This was a totally unforced situation which is what I find amazing. This must be the most self-destructive chain of events I've seen unfold in real life. Either way, I don't think Gizmo will lose his supporters... but you can bet they will be checking and double checking in future even if they do go back.

Ego is a terrible thing... this could have been handled SO MUCH BETTER with some maturity.

This is not the only person involved in such things - more will surface now after this thread I'm sure.

@"TurboLlew" raise:

I have read, then gone back, and re-read the entire thread of "he said-she said", and was slowly formulating my own response or 10cents worth
But
after reading your response, I think we are on the same wavelength here.

Gizmo's indescretions aside, his technical knwoledge and forum advice he has can still be very usefull to the forum, even if the forum-ites don't utilize his actual service.
The forum doesn't exist only to drum up business for your own workshop, but also a place to
1) Admire the brand
2) Get technical advice, ( and I believe that Gizmo's technical knowledge is invaluable for the internet forum)
3) Physically requesting Gizmo to do the actual work....(which is in essence OFF FORUM) then this thread will be a warning to beware

In the same way that an Ex-Con will always be an Ex-Con, the workmanship and knowledge doesn't die, just the physical trust in the work itself

Indiscretions aside?? Are you serious?   :roflol: :roflol: :roflol:


[font=Tahoma, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]I am sorry, I have to disagree here...He is not a GOD nor does his invaluable technical knowledge excuse his actions at all.[/font]

[font=Tahoma, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]You are welcome to call or whatsapp or contact him for his invaluable advice that you think so highly off or you can also refer people if you must...I for one, do not want a mechanic who has done what he has done before, on this forum.[/font]

[font=Tahoma, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]Period![/font]

[font=Tahoma, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]There are many people in and around Jhb who are doing the work he does and drumming up t[/font][font=Tahoma, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]he experience as well, young and old...on this forum he gets a thumbs up but many off this forum are capable and many who don't frequent this forum are still contactable and still help...with honesty to add.[/font]

[font=Tahoma, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]I vote a ban...as long as he h[/font][font=Tahoma, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]as access to the forum...he has access to everyone who can be new and vulnerable people also. People can read his threads and when they see the strike across his name and this thread...then they will immediately get the idea. But this should not be his platform to get more clients AT ALL.[/font]

[font=Tahoma, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]Like I said, you can do whatever you want BUT i don't vote allowing him any further here. 

If you dont understand me yet, read Rayzor's response...morals and integrity first...[/font]

 

[cRed001]

If I were a customer that had been defrauded, I'd want financial compensation for what was stolen from me. Coming clean and apologising when you been caught in your own web of lies and deceit doesn't mean anything.

 

[boost3d]

I am so glad i'm not back in the moderation room, discussing this issue to death for the upteenth time.

Spare a moment for the Mods,Admin and owners behind the scenes, they are often faced with challenges and issues that affect the forum and whilst it might seem that they are not intervening i can assure you that right now, they are busy trying to come up with a plan of action around this!

Maybe , if allowed we can put up an anonymous poll and forumites can vote on whether Warren should stay or be banned and have all his rep points removed. This is afterall a democracy and not a dictatorship and no single person should play, judge, jury, executioner

 

[Peter@AEW]

Yubs clearly comprehension is not your forte.

You come here with your Sherlock Holmes approach and I respond as follows

Read the thread sir and if you do not understand and comprehend what has been laid bare I cannot help you.

Now had you deemed it appropriate to text me I would have explained it to you and equally assisted you in understanding such things as etiquette and the like.

You being serious?
Really?
WOW!


[font=Tahoma, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]Peter, I will not stoop to your condescending level in my response to you.

[/font]You just did

[font=Tahoma, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]My questions were asked to offer clarity for myself as well as for those that also needed it.[/font]
[font=Tahoma, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]Moose started off by apologizing for making this a public issue. In your opening post you did not make mention of whether Moose asked you to post this public. So did you do it against his wishes or without his knowledge?[/font]
You role is to moderate threads not try and incite.
[font=Tahoma, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]I know you have made it abundantly clear on many occasions that you do not approve of me being a Moderator and that I am a poor Moderator.
[/font]Your consistent behaviour leads one to that conclusion however have nothing against you as a person

[font=Tahoma, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]I'm sorry you feel that way.[/font]

[font=Tahoma, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]I'm not sure if you are feeling that I am trying to defend Gizmo's actions in any way, cos that is certainly not the case. Honesty, ethics, integrity should be the ethos of every workshop and that clearly lacked from Gizmo's side and also for others that co-exist on this forum.[/font]
[font=Tahoma, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]I can jog you 64 year old memory to events that took place in the past where workshops ethics were questioned as well but that would just derail this thread.
[/font]Thank you for being oblique and neutral. You being serious? Sure you are so just look at my point 2 as to why I believe that as a moderator you suck.
As to my age all I have to say to you is that where you are I have been and where I am you still need to get to.
I hope that your journey is easy

[font=Tahoma, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]Lastly, I acknowledge you PM  and note that I had no desire to call or text you and lose 30-60 mins of my life last night by listening to you when the crux of thread was already determined as to what transpired between Moose and Gizmo.
[/font]If it was clear to you as you state what the heck were you doing by posting that inane post?

[font=Tahoma, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]Cheers[/font]

 

[nish_M240i]

Whoyo, I think this is going to drag on for a few days.

 

[AshG108]

The amount of crap coming to light now is amazing....

 

[Nikhil]

I am so glad i'm not back in the moderation room, discussing this issue to death for the upteenth time.

Spare a moment for the Mods,Admin and owners behind the scenes, they are often faced with challenges and issues that affect the forum and whilst it might seem that they are not intervening i can assure you that right now, they are busy trying to come up with a plan of action around this!

Maybe , if allowed we can put up an anonymous poll and forumites can vote on whether Warren should stay or be banned and have all his rep points removed. This is afterall a democracy and not a dictatorship and no single person should play, judge, jury, executioner

It's been a rough week, let's take the weekend off to reflect on the the current situation and approach it with a fresh mind on Monday. Even tho the decision and outcome will remain the same as everyone already has a firm stance on the topic

 

[boost3d]

I am so glad i'm not back in the moderation room, discussing this issue to death for the upteenth time.

Spare a moment for the Mods,Admin and owners behind the scenes, they are often faced with challenges and issues that affect the forum and whilst it might seem that they are not intervening i can assure you that right now, they are busy trying to come up with a plan of action around this!

Maybe , if allowed we can put up an anonymous poll and forumites can vote on whether Warren should stay or be banned and have all his rep points removed. This is afterall a democracy and not a dictatorship and no single person should play, judge, jury, executioner

It's been a rough week, let's take the weekend off to reflect on the the current situation and approach it with a fresh mind on Monday. Even tho the decision and outcome will remain the same as everyone already has a firm stance on the topic

:roflol: