Drinking and driving

[Dirtydeedsman]

(RTMC) wants drunk drivers to spend at least 7 days in jail before they can be considered for bail.

The RTMC was established for co-operative and coordinated strategic planning, regulation, facilitation and law enforcement in respect of road traffic matters.

The Sunday Times reported that the RTMC is pushing for tougher action against drunk drivers ahead of the festive season.

According to the Sunday Times, the RTMC wants drunk driving, speeding, and reckless and negligent driving to be reclassified in terms of the Criminal Procedures Act.

It wants driving under the influence to be reclassified from a schedule 2 to schedule 5 offence, putting it on par with rape, murder, theft, and fraud.

Big impact on drunk drivers
Plans to reclassify drunk driving and other traffic offences in terms of the Criminal Procedures Act is not new.

In April 2017 BusinessTech reported that the SA traffic department was in discussions with the justice department to institute harsher punishments for motorists who drink and drive.

These planned punishments included a mandatory 2-year jail sentence with no bail.

Former transport Minister Joe Maswanganyi said that the introduction of minimum sentences for negligent and reckless driving was part of the department’s long-term strategy to curb road casualties.

The idea is to reclassify drunken driving to a schedule 5 offence, to ensure that those who negligently cause crashes on the roads do not get bail easily and spend time behind bars.

Those convicted under a schedule 5 offence face a recommended minimum sentence of 15 years in jail.

SAPS drinking and driving warning
According to the South African Police Service (SAPS) it has a zero-tolerance policy against drinking and driving.

The SAPS said it is committed to reducing this crime, particularly over festive periods such as the Christmas holidays.

South African law – Section 65 of the National Road Traffic Act 93 of 1996 – prohibits people from driving when their blood has an alcohol content level of more than 0.05 grams per 100 millilitres.

For professional drivers the law is even stricter, stipulating that they may not drive when their alcohol content level is higher than 0.02 grams per 100 millilitres.

“This means that even after what you may think is a small drink, you could be over the limit,” the SAPS says.

“If you have more than 350ml of beer, or if you have more than a single tot of brandy or other spirit, you may already be over the limit.”

It also reminded people that alcohol can remain in their system for up to 8 hours after consumption.

Current punishment for drunken driving
If you are stopped and it is determined that you have consumed more than the legal limit of alcohol, you will be arrested and charged with “Driving Under the Influence of Liquor”.

You will then be held in custody until you are able to post bail. In certain instances, bail may be denied.

Depending on prior convictions against you, as well as the circumstances surrounding your arrest, you face a minimum fine of R2,000 or a two-year prison sentence, or both.

“You may also lose your driver’s licence, or have it suspended. And, of course, you will have a criminal record,” the SAPS said.

According to South Africans Against Drunk Driving, aggravating circumstances like death or severe injury can increase the fines to between R120,000 and R180,000.

Drunk drivers can also face jail sentences of up to 9 years for causing severe injury or death.

SOURCE

This is a good incentive as I am very much behind this. Just a few things that bother me:

1. The system is already over burdened and if someone is facing the prospects of 7 days in prison they they are going to pay more in bribe to get out which is just basically just going to put more money in the police pockets

2. Taking one to jail assumes they are guilty already without proper constitutional processing. They said Jail not Holding cells...

3.Where are we going to put all these people? the current infrastructure cannot support the available numbers already.

I am not a supporter of drinking and driving but I think the way they are approaching this is wrong. The current system is fine we just need to pay police officers more so that they do their jobs instead of having to subsidize their salaries on the road...

my 2c

 

[Nick]

"proper constitutional processing" :roflol:

 

[Dirtydeedsman]

"proper constitutional processing" :roflol:

I'm getting my political dictionary on...

:roflol:

 

[Nick]

Ye, look i think if you get caught driving drunk you need to be sorted out, the problem comes in when these boozed up peoples emotions start maxing out, Chic's crying, dudes saying " do you know who i am!"

I dont want that job.

 

[individj]

im gna get shot for saying this but you can be over the limit by having one whisky...think 7 days is a bit much...get serious with people jumping robots and taxis!

 

[MiteshN]

I guess there is no 1 correct answer to this. The proposed law has it's benefits, but then as individj says 1 whiskey already puts you over the limit, and that is a bit aggressive I think.

The best way is for each case to be individually dealt with. I don't think most guys (and girls) that have a drink or 2 are dangerous. If you get caught with being over the limit and cause an incident (accident, death, etc.) then yes, they can implement the harsh sentence. But if it is just in a roadblock, and the person is mildly over the limit but still fully capable of driving and make rational decisions then a simple fine will suffice.

I have seen many accidents with major fatalities not due to alcohol but just simple arrogant driving, those are the main culprits.

My 2cents worth.

 

[individj]

also lets sort out a safe & reliable public transport system mgwaiting:

 

[WyKiD]

Driving under the influence is vilianised same as the the whole speed kills mantra, due to them being big money spinners for govt coffers and pockets of corrupt officers...

Not condoning either but the same focus should be placed on unroadworthy vehicles, flagrant disregard for most rules of the road, illegally obtained drivers licenses, etc.....

 

[Jeremy.d]

I wish they had this same energy about fixing potholes:fencelook:

 

[individj]

hahaha...so they closed a taxi rank in Cape Town...the taxi drivers then proceeded to double park on the bridge close by...traffic cops everywhere..i hoot at them and shout that wtf is going on..taxis reversing on the bridge..double parking...traffic cop waved his hand and said "ag"
They had an operation where they checked one or two taxis...shot a traffic cop...never happened again..they are piss scared...much easier to target young ladies for having a glass of wine with dinner.

 

[peanut125i]

The days of drinking and driving are long gone and with goodfellas, buddies, uber and the like available. My opinion is there is no excuse or justification for driving under the influence.

Sent from my SM-N950F using Tapatalk

 

[Tinuva]

The days of drinking and driving are long gone and with goodfellas, buddies, uber and the like available. My opinion is there is no excuse or justification for driving under the influence.

Sent from my SM-N950F using Tapatalk

Pretty much on point.
I will happily pay R200 for Uber (thats how much it costs for Uber from town to home for me) over spending a single night in holding. Not just saying this, I actually did this already last month, and will probably this and next month with all the year end functions happening.

If everyone do this, there will be no one left to charge or bribe for drunk driving, and they will move focus to the next thing of the month.

 

[tman]

Police can't even enforce current laws. People driving more reckless every day, more people dying on our roads due to the fact that there is no consequences.

If I were in control I'd stop creating fancy legislation and focus on enforcing current legislation that no one gives a rats ass about.

Sent on the move using Tapatalk

 

[Echo03]

Os so here is my 2c worth, and please note that I am involved in roadblocks etc on a regular basis.

I believe what they want to do is that if you are found guilty of drunk driving BY THE COURT, you will be sentenced to 7 days in jail before the "bail"(read fine) can be paid.

Reason for my statement, and PLEASE remember this when pulled over guys, a breathalyzer reading may not be used in court as evidence, only drawn blood samples form a sealed blood-kit that was opened while you witness, drawn by a qualified nurse or doctor can be used as evidence.

Basically they can not sentence you to 7 Days in jail on a breathalyzer reading and there is no way in hell they are getting blood-test results back the same night.

Scare tactics and a little sloppy reporting, but hay if it scares the ones drinking and driving enough to stop, so be it, but rather take that uber when you had a few guys.

 

[MiteshN]

Os so here is my 2c worth, and please note that I am involved in roadblocks etc on a regular basis.

I believe what they want to do is that if you are found guilty of drunk driving BY THE COURT, you will be sentenced to 7 days in jail before the "bail"(read fine) can be paid.

Reason for my statement, and PLEASE remember this when pulled over guys, a breathalyzer reading may not be used in court as evidence, only drawn blood samples form a sealed blood-kit that was opened while you witness, drawn by a qualified nurse or doctor can be used as evidence.

Basically they can not sentence you to 7 Days in jail on a breathalyzer reading and there is no way in hell they are getting blood-test results back the same night.

Scare tactics and a little sloppy reporting, but hay if it scares the ones drinking and driving enough to stop, so be it, but rather take that uber when you had a few guys.

Echo03, so what are the immediate consequences of being stopped at a roadblock when you have had a drink or 2? If the breathalyzer says you are over the limit, is that not enough to have you arrested? Or can they only issue you a fine, and if you contest it saying there was no blood test done, then you can easily get off. But if you insist at the roadblock that the breathalyzer is not sufficient, can they not detain you and then request a blood test, which can hold up in court, but obviously with the added disadvantage of being detained for the blood tests first?

 

[Kimeran]

Os so here is my 2c worth, and please note that I am involved in roadblocks etc on a regular basis.

I believe what they want to do is that if you are found guilty of drunk driving BY THE COURT, you will be sentenced to 7 days in jail before the "bail"(read fine) can be paid.

Reason for my statement, and PLEASE remember this when pulled over guys, a breathalyzer reading may not be used in court as evidence, only drawn blood samples form a sealed blood-kit that was opened while you witness, drawn by a qualified nurse or doctor can be used as evidence.

Basically they can not sentence you to 7 Days in jail on a breathalyzer reading and there is no way in hell they are getting blood-test results back the same night.

Scare tactics and a little sloppy reporting, but hay if it scares the ones drinking and driving enough to stop, so be it, but rather take that uber when you had a few guys.

Echo03, so what are the immediate consequences of being stopped at a roadblock when you have had a drink or 2? If the breathalyzer says you are over the limit, is that not enough to have you arrested? Or can they only issue you a fine, and if you contest it saying there was no blood test done, then you can easily get off. But if you insist at the roadblock that the breathalyzer is not sufficient, can they not detain you and then request a blood test, which can hold up in court, but obviously with the added disadvantage of being detained for the blood tests first?

A breathalyzer will be done, if you are over the limit then you will be taken to the police station where they will do blood tests and set free once you pay bail.

I understand where everyone is coming from about this being a bit harsh, but I guess we will only understand how serious the situation is if us or people we know are involved in it.

Maybe they should look into punishing you based on the amount of alcohol in your blood, similar to speeding.

So if you are 20-30% over the limit, 1 night in jail and so on.

 

[flintstone]

I had the opportunity to spend some time in Soweto, Dobsonvilly and surrounding areas this past Saturday. There were people drinking all over the place during the morning around 10am. Went pass a small shopping centre (Pick N Pay) and guys were jumping into the drivers seat with open an bottle in their hands. Police were driving around near by but it didnt seem to bother anyone. I asked the local guys why no concern here? The reply I got is police dont worry much about them and may just ask for a bribe.

Was definitely an experience, things are very different dependent on which side of the fence you on.

 

[ChrisBrand]

If you can afford a beer, you can afford an Uber.

 

[Echo03]

Echo03, so what are the immediate consequences of being stopped at a roadblock when you have had a drink or 2? If the breathalyzer says you are over the limit, is that not enough to have you arrested? Or can they only issue you a fine, and if you contest it saying there was no blood test done, then you can easily get off. But if you insist at the roadblock that the breathalyzer is not sufficient, can they not detain you and then request a blood test, which can hold up in court, but obviously with the added disadvantage of being detained for the blood tests first?

A breathalyzer will be done, if you are over the limit then you will be taken to the police station where they will do blood tests and set free once you pay bail.

I understand where everyone is coming from about this being a bit harsh, but I guess we will only understand how serious the situation is if us or people we know are involved in it.

Maybe they should look into punishing you based on the amount of alcohol in your blood, similar to speeding.

So if you are 20-30% over the limit, 1 night in jail and so on.

Excactly what Kimeran said.

You will be tested at the roadblock with a breathalyzer, then arrested and taken to nearest police station. They will either have a nurse their or you will be transported to a hospital for blood test, you will then need to pay bail before being set free.

The results of the blood test will then be made available for your court appearance, however they can not use the breathalyzer reading court. This is the reason in them saying blood needs to be drawn within two hours of the arrest as to get you as close as possible to the breathalyzer reading. And most of the time if you were not over the limit the results of the blood test seems to mysteriously "get lost".

So yes you will be arrested on the spot still, but they will not be able to keep you there for 7 days on the breathalyzer reading, that is why I said you will most likely only get 7 days after your court date. Presumed innocent until proven guilty remember.

I agree with the punishment according to blood alcohol level, this might be a good way of going.

This all comes down to the same point in the end, DON'T drink and drive.

 

[individj]

aaahhh..the days where you could have a rum..drive home & it was all legal